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Author Topic: Transfer Pumps?  (Read 268 times)

acarter

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Transfer Pumps?
« on: December 20, 2017, 08:33:35 am »
Lets talk pumps... what is everyone using to transfer their WMO in the cold weather? The pump I have (that came with my used burner) worked ok in the warmer weather, but when it gets below freezing my transfer rate is way less than 1 gpm. It is a "gear mesh" style pump.

I'm thinking an air operated diaphragm pump, like the link below would do the trick. This is about the cheapest one I found, it is rated for 12gpm, but I would be happy for 2 or 3 when it's below freezing.

https://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/product_200623841_200623841

I think I've got the burner figured out (fingers crossed), this morning makes my first 24 hours without having to go reset it, so it's time to invest some money into transferring the oil.

olscout99

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Re: Transfer Pumps?
« Reply #1 on: December 20, 2017, 10:42:47 am »
That looks like a good pump for what you want to do, and that is a great price compared to what I have seen for those type pumps. I have one similar to this, only because I got a steal of a deal on it on Ebay.  It works great but is noisy. I plumbed it with a spin on filter adaptor on the outlet so the oil is somewhat filtered as I pump from one tank to the next. My 'burner' tank is a 120 gallon aluminum truck saddle tank with the pump, a Goldenrod water block filter, and pressure regulators mounted on top, so the oil is filtered before it gets to the burner also. I think the water block is around 17 microns, so the oil going to the gun should be pretty clean which hopefully results in a better burn and less clean up. I'd say go for that deal, you probably won't get that GPM in cold weather but it will still move oil.
Link to similar pump I have- https://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/product_200685591_200685591?cm_mmc=Google-pla&utm_source=Google_PLA&utm_medium=Fuel%20Transfer%20%2B%20Lubrication%20%3E%20Oil%20Pumps&utm_campaign=Ingersoll%20Rand%20ARO&utm_content=60399&gclid=EAIaIQobChMInLrGrYOZ2AIVVrXACh3l2QRxEAYYBCABEgK-RfD_BwE

doug

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Re: Transfer Pumps?
« Reply #2 on: December 20, 2017, 06:28:18 pm »
 I had diaphragm pump similar to the Northern pump. I never got that much volume of that pump. It also took a enormous amount of air that my compressor could not produce. I have a small Craftsman compressor. I currently have a hydraulic pump powered with a 3/4hp 1725rpm electric motor. it moves oil at around 5gpm + when it's warm and of course less when cold.

 This summer I did the small block chevy  oil pump mod to turn it into a waste oil transfer pump. My current electric motor 3/4hp 3425rpm has trouble moving the oil in cold weather. I need to find a bigger motor.

 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fkBIYcT6j8U



« Last Edit: December 20, 2017, 06:31:37 pm by doug »
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http://wasteoilheaterforum.com/index.php?topic=102.0

olscout99

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Re: Transfer Pumps?
« Reply #3 on: December 20, 2017, 07:48:45 pm »
I have one of the modified small block Chevy oil pumps, but it's messy and I never got around to properly mounting it. I think if you had a slower motor of less HP you'd be better off. I have run mine with a half inch drill many times, and although it's tough on the drill it does work. I bet a good 1/2 hp motor at 1725 rpm would turn it alright. Cold oil is always going to be tough to pump no matter how you do it.

doug

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Re: Transfer Pumps?
« Reply #4 on: December 20, 2017, 08:43:25 pm »
 I was thinking a slower motor 1725rpm like you suggested would be better. I still think it needs more power maybe 1hp. As it is now it will really pulls the motor down to where the motor stalls. The pump is a high volume with 3/4" fitting welded to the pump with 1" suction and discharge hoses. This was built to move large quantizes of 100gal +. Not sure a drill would stand up to that.
« Last Edit: December 21, 2017, 07:09:45 am by doug »
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http://wasteoilheaterforum.com/index.php?topic=102.0

ShopSpecialties

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Re: Transfer Pumps?
« Reply #5 on: December 20, 2017, 09:15:32 pm »
Air diaphragm pump is the best for moving cold oil but they do require a large volume of air to operate. For electric motors I would go down to 1140 RPM for cold oil. 

doug

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Re: Transfer Pumps?
« Reply #6 on: December 21, 2017, 12:55:35 pm »
Thanks for the suggestion. Does a lower rpm motor of the same hp have more torque?
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ShopSpecialties

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Re: Transfer Pumps?
« Reply #7 on: December 22, 2017, 01:01:28 am »
Thanks for the suggestion. Does a lower rpm motor of the same hp have more torque?

Good question and I am not sure if it does have more torque.

olscout99

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Re: Transfer Pumps?
« Reply #8 on: December 22, 2017, 10:40:15 am »
That is a good question, it seems like maybe it does because most of the high torque applications like pumps and larger air compressors are driven by slower RPM motors. Maybe because it takes less starting current to start lower rpms? 

doug

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Re: Transfer Pumps?
« Reply #9 on: December 22, 2017, 01:34:16 pm »
3450rpm is asking a lot for that sbc pump. Slowing down the rpm the motor may not need as much the horse power. If that makes any since.
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Russ

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Re: Transfer Pumps?
« Reply #10 on: December 23, 2017, 10:43:18 am »
Yes, that is an interesting question.  Wanting to know more about the subject myself, I did a little digging around.

I'm no expert in this area, but if I understand the chart on this page:
https://www.engineeringtoolbox.com/electrical-motors-hp-torque-rpm-d_1503.html

It does look like a motor of the same HP, turning slower, will have more torque.

acarter

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Re: Transfer Pumps?
« Reply #11 on: December 26, 2017, 12:55:29 pm »
I just ordered the diaphragm pump from northern tool. I'll post back once I see how it works...

Austin

doug

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Re: Transfer Pumps?
« Reply #12 on: December 26, 2017, 01:42:01 pm »
Russ, Thanks for the chart. if I'm reading the chart right I believe a lower rpm should have more torque. Who knew.
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acarter

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Re: Transfer Pumps?
« Reply #13 on: January 07, 2018, 06:28:26 pm »
Well, I used the new diaphragm pump for the first time yesterday. Much better than the old gear mesh pump. Oil and air temp was around 20 degrees F, pumping through a screen filter and hydraulic filter I probably get about 2gpm, unrestricted (no filter) probably closer to 5gpm. I'm happy with that, in the warm weather I'm sure it will get close to the rated 12gpm...

Austin